Winter tyres discussion!!
Winter tyres discussion!!
The roads are covered in snow and everyone drives without a problem.
With us numpties with our summer tyres on we would not be able to drive in their roads.
Some of them have studded tyres and some not.
I think I will get some for our cars and see how we get on, but just need some suggestions on what kind to get from our members who stay in the snowy places:Fish::laugh:
Lexus IS200 Mods--TTE Supercharger, Tein Superstreet Coilovers & EDFC, 6000K HID Lights, HKS Silent High Power Exhaust, DBA Front Discs, Kenwood DNX9240 Head Unit, 19" Rims, TRD Kit, FIGS Bonnet Struts, Greddy Pillar Pod & Defi Gauges, TTE Red ARBS . And Been To WIM twice
Well we are in Norway just now, and seeing how everyone else drives with Winter tyrse on I think its a must for us to do ther same.
The roads are covered in snow and everyone drives without a problem.
With us numpties with our summer tyres on we would not be able to drive in their roads.
Some of them have studded tyres and some not.
I think I will get some for our cars and see how we get on, but just need some suggestions on what kind to get from our members who stay in the snowy places:Fish::laugh:
Lexus IS200 Mods--TTE Supercharger, Tein Superstreet Coilovers & EDFC, 6000K HID Lights, HKS Silent High Power Exhaust, DBA Front Discs, Kenwood DNX9240 Head Unit, 19" Rims, TRD Kit, FIGS Bonnet Struts, Greddy Pillar Pod & Defi Gauges, TTE Red ARBS . And Been To WIM twice
Moley Well we are in Norway just now, and seeing how everyone else drives with Winter tyrse on I think its a must for us to do ther same.
The roads are covered in snow and everyone drives without a problem.
With us numpties with our summer tyres on we would not be able to drive in their roads.
Some of them have studded tyres and some not.
I think I will get some for our cars and see how we get on, but just need some suggestions on what kind to get from our members who stay in the snowy places:Fish::laugh:
Is it worth it though ? Surely you'll be swapping them on and off after a few days or so, unlike Scandinavian countries where you could leave them on for several months ?
![[Image: Sig-enginebay.jpg]](http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y179/SteveHammatt/Sig-enginebay.jpg)
IS200 Turbo project now just about complete ! See my thread here and leave your comments.
Now running standalone Syvecs ECU and no stock ECU !
steviewevie
09-11-2016, 12:29 AM #2Moley Well we are in Norway just now, and seeing how everyone else drives with Winter tyrse on I think its a must for us to do ther same.
The roads are covered in snow and everyone drives without a problem.
With us numpties with our summer tyres on we would not be able to drive in their roads.
Some of them have studded tyres and some not.
I think I will get some for our cars and see how we get on, but just need some suggestions on what kind to get from our members who stay in the snowy places:Fish::laugh:
Is it worth it though ? Surely you'll be swapping them on and off after a few days or so, unlike Scandinavian countries where you could leave them on for several months ?
IS200 Turbo project now just about complete ! See my thread here and leave your comments.
Now running standalone Syvecs ECU and no stock ECU !
Lexus IS200 Mods--TTE Supercharger, Tein Superstreet Coilovers & EDFC, 6000K HID Lights, HKS Silent High Power Exhaust, DBA Front Discs, Kenwood DNX9240 Head Unit, 19" Rims, TRD Kit, FIGS Bonnet Struts, Greddy Pillar Pod & Defi Gauges, TTE Red ARBS . And Been To WIM twice
Steve what you must understand is winter tyres are not just for snow but when the temp goes down below 5 or so degrees so it would be worth it in my opinion
Lexus IS200 Mods--TTE Supercharger, Tein Superstreet Coilovers & EDFC, 6000K HID Lights, HKS Silent High Power Exhaust, DBA Front Discs, Kenwood DNX9240 Head Unit, 19" Rims, TRD Kit, FIGS Bonnet Struts, Greddy Pillar Pod & Defi Gauges, TTE Red ARBS . And Been To WIM twice
2002 '02' IS200 SE Auto - DVD Satnav with Voice Activation - [COLOR="Blue"]Strathcaron Blue - Parking Sensors - 5000K HIDs with Anti-Glare Bulbs - PIAA 6500K Main Beams - LED Sidelights - Mirror/Sunroof Closure - TTE Styling Kit - 18" Styling Kit Alloys with nitrogen filled Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetric Tyres - Bluetouch Multimedia Kit - Gromaudio AUX in - Black painted calipers with silver Lexus decals - 12 LED Dome Light - 96 LED Boot Light - Stainless Steel Sport Sill Plates - PIAA Silicone Wipers[/COLOR]
After today's experience, I'm seriously considering getting a set of winter tyres for the 17s I have in the garage - as moley says it's not just for snow, surely they'll provide better grip throughout the colder months.
2002 '02' IS200 SE Auto - DVD Satnav with Voice Activation - [COLOR="Blue"]Strathcaron Blue - Parking Sensors - 5000K HIDs with Anti-Glare Bulbs - PIAA 6500K Main Beams - LED Sidelights - Mirror/Sunroof Closure - TTE Styling Kit - 18" Styling Kit Alloys with nitrogen filled Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetric Tyres - Bluetouch Multimedia Kit - Gromaudio AUX in - Black painted calipers with silver Lexus decals - 12 LED Dome Light - 96 LED Boot Light - Stainless Steel Sport Sill Plates - PIAA Silicone Wipers[/COLOR]
Winter Tyres - The Main Arguments - FAQs
Winter Tyres are for folk who live in the cold north of Scotland, are they not?
Winter tyres are a big seller across Europe, even Italy (yes, Italy). Part of that is due to the potential for severe weather conditions in Central Europe and in the higher altitudes such as the Alps. However, in some countries the law demands that winter tyres are used during the winter months.
In Germany insurance companies have been known to refuse to pay out where a driver has not fitted winter tyres and had an accident. In Scandinavia it would be virtually impossibly to travel any distance without winter tyres. But in the Uk, is there a real need?
If we go back to the basics of how a tyre functions we will understand that a tyre's grip and traction are determined by its tread compound and its tread pattern (in particular). For a tyre to have grip the rubber needs to be supple in order to flex to grip the road. If the rubber hardens, it loses its grip sooner rather than later. The tread pattern also impacts, and essentially, in slippery conditions the tread with the most leading edges and channels will offer the greater grip. So, if we take a conventional summer tyre with a limited block pattern, and a soft summer compound that sticks to the road in "summer" conditions. How will that fare in the winter? For one, as the temperature drops the tyre tread will stiffen - reducing grip. In wet, or snowy conditions the summer channelling may not pump away sufficient water and the tyre is prone to aquaplaning at an earlier stage.
So, how do we address those issues? We get the tyre designers to produce a tyre with a compound that remains sticker for longer in colder temperatures, and we ask him to design in more leading edges through a blockier design with lots of siping (slits to add leading edges and pump water. We then have a cold weather or, winter tyre. That performs better in the cold and wet.
How important is that to us in the UK?
On the few days that we do have snow in the UK most motorists adapt their driving to suit (and the highways very quickly turn to gridlock). However, the visible differences between driving in damp conditions in summer and in winter are not noticeable and most drivers do not adapt to winter driving conditions in the wet.
There is a point at which winter tyre compounds offer better adhesion than summer tyre compounds, and that is when the temperature drops below 7 degrees Celsius. This is the point at which summer tyres start to harden and their performance drops. Softer winter tyre compounds keep sticking better for another 15 degrees or so. Those conditions (below 7 degrees) apply in the UK at peak driving times for a surprising four months every year.
That means that in lower temperatures the winter tyres can save as much as 11metres braking distance at 50kph. That's a whole trucklength.
When put in that context winter, or cold weather tyres can be a lifesaver, they can certainly help minimise the risk to your insurance premium over the winter months.
Two Camps
Traditionally, winter tyres were big, chunky tyres that often saw service on rally cars. Nowadays things are a great deal more complex and it is recognised that the tyre needs to do more than just grip in the snow.
One train of thought is that tyres should have a tread pattern that is self cleaning and doesn't retain snow and ice, so that there are always fresh leading edges to grip a snow covered surface. The other is that the tread should be designed to retain snow and ice to improve all round grip. Now that latter case takes some consideration. It is explained thus; make two snowballs and then rub them together. The friction between the two snowballs is so great that both disintegrate in your hands. Snow sticks to snow. Try rubbing a snowball on a tyre, it just slips off. So, the theory goes that snow stuck in the tread of a tyre can improve its performance in the snow. You pays your money and you takes your choice.
The same theory does not quite apply to ice though.
What about the cost?
On the face of things you are buying two sets of tyres, so your costs are doubled, but, since you are splitting the mileage done on each set of tyres you extend their life expectancy. Anecdotal evidence suggests that on buying a new car and fitting it with winter tyres over the cold weather period and summer tyres at other times, not only does the driver have improved winter safety but his tyres actually last longer. Over a five year period it is claimed that running winter and summer tyres can save the cost of a whole replacement set of tyres. Of course that is anecdotal and depends upon mileage and driving style.
So what do I do with my spare tyres?
Tyre storage is indeed an issue. The tendency is to store spare tyres at the back of the garage until you need them. The safe option is to keep them on spare rims (which makes sense to protect you summer alloys anyway) and keep them in a cool dark place where they can be rotated from time to time to prevent weak spots developing. Or, you could approach a local tyre dealer and ask him to store your wheels and tyres for you. Tyre Hotels are common in Northern Europe, but there are a few in the UK.
[COLOR="Red"]
And if I use winter tyres in the summer?[/COLOR]
You will obviously find greater wear on your winter tyres because at summer temperatures they are much softer than summer tyres, However, that in turn makes them stickier, so there is no real reason why you should not use winter tyres all year round is you wish, and you don't mind the higher noise level, and the greater wear and tear.
Lexus IS200 Sport Navigator (Now being stripped again) :blink:
Now Don't Forget The REP!!!
From another site!
Winter Tyres - The Main Arguments - FAQs
Winter Tyres are for folk who live in the cold north of Scotland, are they not?
Winter tyres are a big seller across Europe, even Italy (yes, Italy). Part of that is due to the potential for severe weather conditions in Central Europe and in the higher altitudes such as the Alps. However, in some countries the law demands that winter tyres are used during the winter months.
In Germany insurance companies have been known to refuse to pay out where a driver has not fitted winter tyres and had an accident. In Scandinavia it would be virtually impossibly to travel any distance without winter tyres. But in the Uk, is there a real need?
If we go back to the basics of how a tyre functions we will understand that a tyre's grip and traction are determined by its tread compound and its tread pattern (in particular). For a tyre to have grip the rubber needs to be supple in order to flex to grip the road. If the rubber hardens, it loses its grip sooner rather than later. The tread pattern also impacts, and essentially, in slippery conditions the tread with the most leading edges and channels will offer the greater grip. So, if we take a conventional summer tyre with a limited block pattern, and a soft summer compound that sticks to the road in "summer" conditions. How will that fare in the winter? For one, as the temperature drops the tyre tread will stiffen - reducing grip. In wet, or snowy conditions the summer channelling may not pump away sufficient water and the tyre is prone to aquaplaning at an earlier stage.
So, how do we address those issues? We get the tyre designers to produce a tyre with a compound that remains sticker for longer in colder temperatures, and we ask him to design in more leading edges through a blockier design with lots of siping (slits to add leading edges and pump water. We then have a cold weather or, winter tyre. That performs better in the cold and wet.
How important is that to us in the UK?
On the few days that we do have snow in the UK most motorists adapt their driving to suit (and the highways very quickly turn to gridlock). However, the visible differences between driving in damp conditions in summer and in winter are not noticeable and most drivers do not adapt to winter driving conditions in the wet.
There is a point at which winter tyre compounds offer better adhesion than summer tyre compounds, and that is when the temperature drops below 7 degrees Celsius. This is the point at which summer tyres start to harden and their performance drops. Softer winter tyre compounds keep sticking better for another 15 degrees or so. Those conditions (below 7 degrees) apply in the UK at peak driving times for a surprising four months every year.
That means that in lower temperatures the winter tyres can save as much as 11metres braking distance at 50kph. That's a whole trucklength.
When put in that context winter, or cold weather tyres can be a lifesaver, they can certainly help minimise the risk to your insurance premium over the winter months.
Two Camps
Traditionally, winter tyres were big, chunky tyres that often saw service on rally cars. Nowadays things are a great deal more complex and it is recognised that the tyre needs to do more than just grip in the snow.
One train of thought is that tyres should have a tread pattern that is self cleaning and doesn't retain snow and ice, so that there are always fresh leading edges to grip a snow covered surface. The other is that the tread should be designed to retain snow and ice to improve all round grip. Now that latter case takes some consideration. It is explained thus; make two snowballs and then rub them together. The friction between the two snowballs is so great that both disintegrate in your hands. Snow sticks to snow. Try rubbing a snowball on a tyre, it just slips off. So, the theory goes that snow stuck in the tread of a tyre can improve its performance in the snow. You pays your money and you takes your choice.
The same theory does not quite apply to ice though.
What about the cost?
On the face of things you are buying two sets of tyres, so your costs are doubled, but, since you are splitting the mileage done on each set of tyres you extend their life expectancy. Anecdotal evidence suggests that on buying a new car and fitting it with winter tyres over the cold weather period and summer tyres at other times, not only does the driver have improved winter safety but his tyres actually last longer. Over a five year period it is claimed that running winter and summer tyres can save the cost of a whole replacement set of tyres. Of course that is anecdotal and depends upon mileage and driving style.
So what do I do with my spare tyres?
Tyre storage is indeed an issue. The tendency is to store spare tyres at the back of the garage until you need them. The safe option is to keep them on spare rims (which makes sense to protect you summer alloys anyway) and keep them in a cool dark place where they can be rotated from time to time to prevent weak spots developing. Or, you could approach a local tyre dealer and ask him to store your wheels and tyres for you. Tyre Hotels are common in Northern Europe, but there are a few in the UK.
[COLOR="Red"]
And if I use winter tyres in the summer?[/COLOR]
You will obviously find greater wear on your winter tyres because at summer temperatures they are much softer than summer tyres, However, that in turn makes them stickier, so there is no real reason why you should not use winter tyres all year round is you wish, and you don't mind the higher noise level, and the greater wear and tear.
Lexus IS200 Sport Navigator (Now being stripped again) :blink:
Now Don't Forget The REP!!!
Moley Steve what you must understand is winter tyres are not just for snow but when the temp goes down below 5 or so degrees so it would be worth it in my opinionIndeed, but you were talking about Norway where people are driving in snow without any problem. Are you talking about studded tyres or just winter compound tyres ? Because surely winter tyres wouldn't still be that good for driving on snow ?
IS200 Turbo project now just about complete ! See my thread here and leave your comments.
Now running standalone Syvecs ECU and no stock ECU !
steviewevie
09-11-2016, 12:32 PM #7Moley Steve what you must understand is winter tyres are not just for snow but when the temp goes down below 5 or so degrees so it would be worth it in my opinionIndeed, but you were talking about Norway where people are driving in snow without any problem. Are you talking about studded tyres or just winter compound tyres ? Because surely winter tyres wouldn't still be that good for driving on snow ?
IS200 Turbo project now just about complete ! See my thread here and leave your comments.
Now running standalone Syvecs ECU and no stock ECU !
steviewevie Indeed, but you were talking about Norway where people are driving in snow without any problem. Are you talking about studded tyres or just winter compound tyres ? Because surely winter tyres wouldn't still be that good for driving on snow ?
We'll we were driving a VW Passate with just winter compound tyres and we could get up hills that we would not manage to if we were back home on our summer tyres. without slipping and sliding all over the place
Lexus IS200 Mods--TTE Supercharger, Tein Superstreet Coilovers & EDFC, 6000K HID Lights, HKS Silent High Power Exhaust, DBA Front Discs, Kenwood DNX9240 Head Unit, 19" Rims, TRD Kit, FIGS Bonnet Struts, Greddy Pillar Pod & Defi Gauges, TTE Red ARBS . And Been To WIM twice
steviewevie Indeed, but you were talking about Norway where people are driving in snow without any problem. Are you talking about studded tyres or just winter compound tyres ? Because surely winter tyres wouldn't still be that good for driving on snow ?
We'll we were driving a VW Passate with just winter compound tyres and we could get up hills that we would not manage to if we were back home on our summer tyres. without slipping and sliding all over the place
Lexus IS200 Mods--TTE Supercharger, Tein Superstreet Coilovers & EDFC, 6000K HID Lights, HKS Silent High Power Exhaust, DBA Front Discs, Kenwood DNX9240 Head Unit, 19" Rims, TRD Kit, FIGS Bonnet Struts, Greddy Pillar Pod & Defi Gauges, TTE Red ARBS . And Been To WIM twice
Moley We'll we were driving a VW Passate with just winter compound tyres and we could get up hills that we would not manage to if we were back home on our summer tyres. without slipping and sliding all over the place
But isn't that an FWD car ? Not saying the winter tyres wouldn't help a bit too.
IS200 Turbo project now just about complete ! See my thread here and leave your comments.
Now running standalone Syvecs ECU and no stock ECU !
steviewevie
10-11-2016, 03:33 AM #9Moley We'll we were driving a VW Passate with just winter compound tyres and we could get up hills that we would not manage to if we were back home on our summer tyres. without slipping and sliding all over the place
But isn't that an FWD car ? Not saying the winter tyres wouldn't help a bit too.
IS200 Turbo project now just about complete ! See my thread here and leave your comments.
Now running standalone Syvecs ECU and no stock ECU !
steviewevie But isn't that an FWD car ? Not saying the winter tyres wouldn't help a bit too.
Yes it's fwd but thats not the point I'm making Steve.
When we get a bit of snow or ice how many accidents do you see on our roads ??
Over there they can drive without any problems, but here our country comes to a standstill with just a light covering of snow. When we were coming home from Norway yesterday Aberdeen airport was shut with freezing fog in the morning, but when we took off the Norwegian pilot just said about the weather that there was just a bit of mist in Aberdeen, this made me laugh, just shows you the difference between the two
Lexus IS200 Mods--TTE Supercharger, Tein Superstreet Coilovers & EDFC, 6000K HID Lights, HKS Silent High Power Exhaust, DBA Front Discs, Kenwood DNX9240 Head Unit, 19" Rims, TRD Kit, FIGS Bonnet Struts, Greddy Pillar Pod & Defi Gauges, TTE Red ARBS . And Been To WIM twice
steviewevie But isn't that an FWD car ? Not saying the winter tyres wouldn't help a bit too.
Yes it's fwd but thats not the point I'm making Steve.
When we get a bit of snow or ice how many accidents do you see on our roads ??
Over there they can drive without any problems, but here our country comes to a standstill with just a light covering of snow. When we were coming home from Norway yesterday Aberdeen airport was shut with freezing fog in the morning, but when we took off the Norwegian pilot just said about the weather that there was just a bit of mist in Aberdeen, this made me laugh, just shows you the difference between the two
Lexus IS200 Mods--TTE Supercharger, Tein Superstreet Coilovers & EDFC, 6000K HID Lights, HKS Silent High Power Exhaust, DBA Front Discs, Kenwood DNX9240 Head Unit, 19" Rims, TRD Kit, FIGS Bonnet Struts, Greddy Pillar Pod & Defi Gauges, TTE Red ARBS . And Been To WIM twice
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